The Lamb Slain From the Foundation of the World!
This will be a quick response to another feeble attempt by Islam’s most prominent greenhorn, a.k.a. Question Mark, to undermine the necessity of Christ’s death for the forgiveness of sins.
Here is greenhorn’s response to a Christian named “Regular John” who quoted Revelation 13:8 to prove that the reason why God could forgive people even before Jesus actually died is because Christ’s death had been foreordained before creation:
Brother Regular John,
Firstly, Could you kindly prove your statement, “All of forgiveness that God granted prior to Jesus death were base upon Eternal decree of crucifixion since eternity…”?
Regarding your appeal to Revelation 13:8 there here are two fold problems with it:
(i) Let me quote you the verse:
“All people living on earth will worship it, except those whose names were written before the creation of the world in the book of the living which belongs to the Lamb that was killed.” (Revelation 13:8)
So what does the verse prove? How did it helped establish that all forgiveness before Jesus (peace be upon him) were founded on his alleged crucifixion?
All that the verse is saying is, all those whose names were not written from the foundation of the world in the life-book of the Lamb which was slain, will not worship it. Thus, emphasize is on names which those ‘unfortunates’ who were not included in the life-book during the very foundational days of the world; not, that the lamb was slain from the very beginning of the days. As Bible prof. Stuart concurs:
“Prof. Stuart, however (Com. in loco), supposes that this phrase should be connected with the former member of the sentence, “whose names are not written, from the foundation of the world, in the life-book of the Lamb, which was slain.”
But even if we accept for the time being that it was ordained during the very early days of the creation yet (ii) it does not prove that pre-Jesus (peace be upon him) mercies were bestowed because of his alleged cross’s sake.
sincerely,
Q.M. (Shamoun continues to agree: Sins were forgiven before and without the Cross)
It is comments like these which prove that this greenhorn has no business writing articles criticizing Christianity or defending the lies of his false prophet.
Let us help him see what should have been so obvious to him if he only spent some time pondering over the meaning of the passage.
Here is the verse again:
“All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life OF THE LAMB WHO HAS BEEN SLAIN.” Revelation 13:8
The context is referring to those individuals who will worship the beast, i.e. the human ruler whom Satan possesses to oppose God, or his image and who will receive his mark. John is being told that all those whose names are not written in the Lamb’s book of life will inevitably follow after the beast.
The implication of John’s words is that those whose names are written in the book of life will not worship the beast, but will remain faithful to God even till death. This is confirmed by the following passage:
“I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. And the city has no need of the sun or of the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God has illumined it, and its lamp is the Lamb. The nations will walk by its light, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it. In the daytime (for there will be no night there) its gates will never be closed; and they will bring the glory and the honor of the nations into it; and nothing unclean, and no one who practices abomination and lying, shall ever come into it, but only those whose names are written in THE LAMB’S book of life.” Revelation 21:22-27
John also tells us that anyone whose name is not found in the Lamb’s book of life shall be thrown into the lake of fire:
“Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds. Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.” Revelation 20:11-15
Now how do these passages establish the fact that Christ’s death had been predestined from the foundation of the world? And how do they prove that the reason God was forgiving and saving his people even before Christ actually died is because Jesus’ death in their place had already been foreordained?
The answer comes from John’s description of the book of life as belonging to the Lamb who had been slain.
The people whose names had been written in the Lamb’s book of life before the creation of the world are those whom Christ redeems by his blood:
“I saw in the right hand of Him who sat on the throne a book written inside and on the back, sealed up with seven seals. And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, ‘Who is worthy to open the book and to break its seals?’ And no one in heaven or on the earth or under the earth was able to open the book or to look into it. Then I began to weep greatly because no one was found worthy to open the book or to look into it; and one of the elders said to me, ‘Stop weeping; behold, the Lion that is from the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has overcome so as to open the book and its seven seals.’ And I saw between the throne (with the four living creatures) and the elders A LAMB STANDING, AS IF SLAIN, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent out into all the earth. And He came and took the book out of the right hand of Him who sat on the throne. When He had taken the book, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each one holding a harp and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. And they sang a new song, saying, ‘Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; FOR YOU WERE SLAIN, AND PURCHASED FOR GOD WITH YOUR BLOOD MEN FROM EVERY TRIBE AND TONGUE AND PEOPLE AND NATION. YOU HAVE MADE THEM to be a kingdom and priests to our God; and they will reign upon the earth.’ Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne and the living creatures and the elders; and the number of them was myriads of myriads, and thousands of thousands, saying with a loud voice, ‘Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power and riches and wisdom and might and honor and glory and blessing.’ And EVERY CREATED THING which is in heaven and on the earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all things in them, I heard saying, ‘To Him who sits on the throne, AND TO THE LAMB, be blessing and honor and glory and dominion forever and ever.’ And the four living creatures kept saying, ‘Amen.’ And the elders fell down and worshiped.” Revelation 5:1-14
As John the Baptist put it:
“The next day he saw Jesus coming to him and said, ‘Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world! This is He on behalf of whom I said, “After me comes a Man who has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.” I did not recognize Him, but so that He might be manifested to Israel, I came baptizing in water.’ John testified saying, ‘I have seen the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven, and He remained upon Him. I did not recognize Him, but He who sent me to baptize in water said to me, “He upon whom you see the Spirit descending and remaining upon Him, this is the One who baptizes in the Holy Spirit.” I myself have seen, and have testified that this is the Son of God.’ Again the next day John was standing with two of his disciples, and he looked at Jesus as He walked, and said, ‘Behold, the Lamb of God!’” John 1:29-36
Hence, since the individuals whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life are those who have been ransomed by the Lamb, and whose sins have been washed in his blood:
“and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To Him who loves us and released us from our sins BY HIS BLOOD—and He has made us to be a kingdom, priests to His God and Father—to Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen.” Revelation 1:5-6
“After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could count, from every nation and all tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne AND BEFORE THE LAMB, clothed in white robes, and palm branches were in their hands; and they cry out with a loud voice, saying, ‘Salvation to our God who sits on the throne, AND TO THE LAMB.’ And all the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures; and they fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, saying, ‘Amen, blessing and glory and wisdom and thanksgiving and honor and power and might, be to our God forever and ever. Amen.’ Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, ‘These who are clothed in the white robes, who are they, and where have they come from?’ I said to him, ‘My lord, you know.’ And he said to me, ‘These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white IN THE BLOOD OF THE LAMB. FOR THIS REASON, they are before the throne of God; and they serve Him day and night in His temple; and He who sits on the throne will spread His tabernacle over them. They will hunger no longer, nor thirst anymore; nor will the sun beat down on them, nor any heat; for THE LAMB in the center of the throne will be their shepherd, and will guide them to springs of the water of life; and God will wipe every tear from their eyes.’” Revelation 7:9-17
This means that the Lamb’s death must have been predestined even before creation, which is precisely what the Apostle Peter wrote in his first inspired epistle:
“If you address as Father the One who impartially judges according to each one’s work, conduct yourselves in fear during the time of your stay on earth; knowing that you were not redeemed with perishable things like silver or gold from your futile way of life inherited from your forefathers, but with precious blood, AS OF A LAMB unblemished and spotless, THE BLOOD OF CHRIST. FOR HE WAS FOREKNOWN (CHOSEN) BEFORE THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD, but has appeared in these last times for the sake of you who through Him are believers in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God.” 1 Peter 1:17-20
In other words, since the names of the redeemed were written in the Lamb’s book of life before the world’s foundation then the means of their salvation must have also been ordained before creation as well. This is precisely why it is called the book of life of the Lamb who had been slain, e.g. it is the book that includes all the names of those whom the Lord Jesus purchased by his sacrificial death on the cross.
This, therefore, establishes my point that everyone prior to Christ actually dying were being saved because of his vicarious sacrifice since God knew that the Lamb, i.e. the Lord Jesus, would be slain in their place in order to free them from their sins.
The late renowned Bible expositor John Gill does an excellent job of summing this up:
whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world; by which book is meant God's predestination of men to eternal life, or his decree of election; why this is called the "book of life", (See Gill on 3:5); and their "names [being] written [therein] from the foundation of the world", (Revelation 17:8) , for such a construction the words will bear, denotes that election is eternal, and is not an act of time, nor dependent upon anything done in time; and that it is of particular persons, and not of bodies of men, of nations and churches, and still less of propositions, or of persons so and so qualified, or under such conditions and circumstances; and that it is perfectly well known to God, and is sure and certain in its effects, and is unchangeable and irrevocable; for what is written in it, is written, and will always stand, not upon the foot of works, but of the sovereign grace of God; and this is called the Lamb's book; that is, Christ, who is compared to a Lamb for its harmlessness, meekness, and patience, and was typified by the lambs in the legal sacrifices; and this book is called his, because he was present at the making of it, and was concerned in putting down the names in it, (John 13:18), and he himself stands first in it as the elect of God, and the head of all the elect, who, as members, were chosen in him: the act of election was made in him, and stands sure in him; and he is the author and giver of that life, which men are chosen unto both here and hereafter: and he may be said to be "slain from the foundation of the world"; in the decree and purpose of God, by which he was set forth, or foreappointed to be the propitiation for sin, and was foreordained, before the foundation of the world, to redeem his people by his blood, and in the promise of God immediately after the fall of man, that the seed of the woman should have his heel bruised, and he himself should bruise the serpent's head, which made it as sure as if it was then done; and in the sacrifices, which were immediately upon this offered up, and were types of the death and sacrifice of Christ; and in the faith of the saints, which brings distant things near, and considers them as if present; and also in his members, in Abel, and others, in whom he suffered, as he still does in his people; to which may be added, that such is the efficacy of the bloodshed and death of Christ, that it reached to all the saints from the beginning of the world, for the justification of their persons, the atonement of their sins, and cleansing from them; for the remission of sins, that are past, and for the redemption of transgressions under the first testament; for Old Testament saints from the beginning are saved by the grace of the Lord Jesus, as New Testament ones are. Something like this the Jews say F5 of the Messiah upon (Genesis 49:11),
“he washed (amle yrbtad amwym), ‘from the day that the world was created’; who is he? this is the King Messiah.--It is written (Genesis 1:2); ‘and the Spirit of God’… This is the Spirit of the King Messiah; and from the day that the world was created; he washed his garments in wine;”
which the Jewish writers F6 understand of blood, which for its redness is like to wine; though they interpret it of the blood of the slain, with which the garments of the Messiah will be stained. Now such whose names are not written in this book of the Lamb, who have no interest in electing grace, nor in redemption by Christ, the slain Lamb of God, nor any right unto eternal life, who are reprobate persons, vessels of wrath fitted for destruction, who are foreordained to condemnation, and are given up to believe a lie, that they might be damned, these are the followers and worshippers of antichrist. (The New John Gill Exposition of the Entire Bible)
Time for greenhorn and his partner in taqiyya, Sami Zaatari, to find another line of work. Attacking Christianity and defending the lies of Islam are simply not cutting it for them.